tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post5731709148658373339..comments2023-08-27T04:22:55.468-07:00Comments on The Literary Lab: Friday Filler! This Week's Episode: Bad AdviceUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger54125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-66535517733379515422011-02-04T23:05:54.809-08:002011-02-04T23:05:54.809-08:00You are forgiven Scott - if you ever give bad advi...You are forgiven Scott - if you ever give bad advice. I'm in the habit of collecting opinions from writers I respect - yes, even aspiring writers - because you never know when the advice will come in handy. <br /><br />May not be useful at the moment it is given, but, things change. My writing style/objectives among them. And as the three of you note in your comments here, your opinions are your opinions. I like the "you're kidding me, right" type comments I see from my own crit partners.<br /><br />@Domey; keep faith in your own ability to give constructive feedback. If it is meant in the spirit of bettering the story, then it is up to the writer to determine how useful it is. You have a lot to offer the writing community, in my opinion. When I first started following the Lab (I think I'm following, I better check) it was your unique voice that kept me coming back long enough to enjoy Michelle and Scott alo.<br /><br />Scott; I love the idea of a ship as a character. Actually, I think any object a person cares about enough to name is a sort of character. You get a sense of the personality through the owner's (in this case I imagine the ship's captain) interaction with the object.<br /><br />I enjoyed your discussion at Andrew's today - it made me think really hard about conflict. Something I struggle with.<br /><br />My son is a devout Steelers fan; but I like the colors the Packers wear :)<br /><br />@Michelle; I read your Lies post today and I enjoyed it immensely. Shares a lot of my own sentiments. *stares at your forehead looking for a third eye* I think I get bogged down in the writing rules sometimes, and that really makes it hard to just write a good story. I appreciated your thoughts on the matter. A timely post for me.<br /><br />........dholedolorahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08715849844092553699noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-91905919151085479332011-02-04T22:00:40.049-08:002011-02-04T22:00:40.049-08:00Hey, rabbit (I'm a rat LOL), I think we've...Hey, rabbit (I'm a rat LOL), I think we've all done the Give Bad Advice bit. I certainly have, and cringe to think of it. Just trying to be helpful, but I'm sure it didn't come across that way. The more we learn, though, the better advice we can give. :)Carol Riggshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14092209912983783974noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-22527500486403061912011-02-04T17:34:04.458-08:002011-02-04T17:34:04.458-08:00Scott, you can make anything ablaze with excitemen...Scott, you can make anything ablaze with excitement, I'm absolutely convinced.Michelle D. Argylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09696465137285587646noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-20556858979072181202011-02-04T17:30:17.067-08:002011-02-04T17:30:17.067-08:00Cheryl Anne Gardner's comment has been working...Cheryl Anne Gardner's comment has been working at my mind all day. I wonder if I will have a section where the ship is speaking to the reader in first person? Hmm. That's almost like something out of Melville, so it appeals to me. Hmm, I say.<br /><br />Jabez, yeah, the book is very loosely based on the 1914 Shackleton expedition, but there will be stuff about race/class divisions in New York at that time, and stuff about growing older (a subject of which I am becoming a reluctant expert), and stuff about friendship and loyalty (the usual suspects in my books) and stuff about how, in truth, the Antarctic is ablaze with color and not all just white and gray and stuff. Also, whales and penguins! American entrepeneurship! Vainglory! Love! Jealousy! Murder! Madness! Drinking and dancing and baseball! Did I mention penguins? Because penguins rock.scott g.f.baileyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05726743149139510832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-70500560525562307392011-02-04T17:10:49.660-08:002011-02-04T17:10:49.660-08:00Still very cool!Still very cool!Jabezhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09541471929373540252noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-33194019829042490552011-02-04T17:10:33.166-08:002011-02-04T17:10:33.166-08:00I'm with you, the more I write the less I offe...I'm with you, the more I write the less I offer advice on how to do it. And I love that the ship in your WIP will have characteristics that will make me love it. Brilliant. #GoSteelersTanahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10518718614911804428noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-33484917637011531192011-02-04T14:56:05.975-08:002011-02-04T14:56:05.975-08:00:)
@Domey: you made my day.
@Scott: You need to ...:)<br /><br />@Domey: you made my day.<br /><br />@Scott: You need to write a writing book. "The X Commandments of Writing" ;)Andrew Rosenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09215333688753781447noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-48394148867640956272011-02-04T14:54:49.616-08:002011-02-04T14:54:49.616-08:00Um...in this case. Not in my scientific work.Um...in this case. Not in my scientific work.Davin Malasarnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09385823575081492949noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-390325921797660572011-02-04T14:54:30.077-08:002011-02-04T14:54:30.077-08:00I'm even okay with presenting things as facts....I'm even okay with presenting things as facts. It takes too long to qualify everything.Davin Malasarnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09385823575081492949noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-79145471648354454652011-02-04T14:52:44.859-08:002011-02-04T14:52:44.859-08:00Opinion? I present all of my advice as cold, hard ...Opinion? I present all of my advice as cold, hard fact, handed down to me from the gods. Which it is. Really. And then I woke up.scott g.f.baileyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05726743149139510832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-62864816025368474062011-02-04T14:49:53.780-08:002011-02-04T14:49:53.780-08:00"I've followed plenty of advice that turn..."I've followed plenty of advice that turned out to be bad, but I would never have known if I had not tried it. The bad advice washes off after a while, the good advice sticks around forever. "<br /><br />I wholeheartedly agree with this.Davin Malasarnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09385823575081492949noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-89164592234154267912011-02-04T14:25:53.234-08:002011-02-04T14:25:53.234-08:00Andrew: I'm not from here, I just live here. G...Andrew: I'm not from here, I just live here. Go Steelers! But, really, I'm more a baseball fan. The Superbowl is the only football game I'll watch all year, and some years I don't even watch it.scott g.f.baileyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05726743149139510832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-36716477722387631702011-02-04T14:21:59.374-08:002011-02-04T14:21:59.374-08:00Wait--you're from here in Seattle and you like...Wait--you're from here in Seattle and you like the Steelers? Booo!<br /><br />Scott, I think your advice is great and you offer a different perspective than most people. I think we writers are all part of a community of thought and we really need to share. <br />I know not every piece of advice I share with other writers either works for them or is even applicable to their story. I've completely pulled back on any "you should do it this way" kind of stuff (vs "have you ever considered") because 90% of the time that kind of advice is useless.<br />One thing I got out of the WDC conference is that "reading and writing are the same, like talking and listening." Taking it a step further, I think talking about writing with fellow writers is even more important, because you never know what you might learn.<br />So keep up the advice, don't be afraid of "bad advice" because there really isn't any if your advice is an honest opinion (and presented as an opinion). <br /><br />I've followed plenty of advice that turned out to be bad, but I would never have known if I had not tried it. The bad advice washes off after a while, the good advice sticks around forever.Andrew Rosenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09215333688753781447noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-26813164582705393992011-02-04T13:54:52.312-08:002011-02-04T13:54:52.312-08:00I don't think I've ever actually recieved ...I don't think I've ever actually recieved bad advice. The only people that I shared my first draft with were - purposely - people who I knew would kind of sugar coat their reviews. Soon I'll give it to someone who will give me some actual feedback though.writergal24https://www.blogger.com/profile/10913320014258720896noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-75981581222241388982011-02-04T13:54:46.129-08:002011-02-04T13:54:46.129-08:00Jabez: Based loosely on the Endurance, but not the...Jabez: Based loosely on the Endurance, but not the Endurance.scott g.f.baileyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05726743149139510832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-70393095759116028332011-02-04T13:04:09.862-08:002011-02-04T13:04:09.862-08:00Just a quick reply for Domey first here (hope that...Just a quick reply for Domey first here (hope that I didn't miss too many replies that already said this same thing I'm in a rush today...)<br /><br />I don't think either could be better- silence, or the critisism. I think though that the worst part about hearing only crickets in response to our writing is that we either have to worry no one even bothered to read it or that it was SO bad they are at a complete loss for words. Then again, scalding negatives hurt...I guess it's all in how the critique is offered.<br /><br />So I don't know. Not helpful, sorry *laugh* just wanted to say Happy Friday anyway! <br /><br />Scott, I agree that advice esp. from non-writers makes me cranky. Advice in general makes me cranky because most of the time people don't have the whole picture/all the info they'd need to offer any really helpful advice that's unsolicited. And usually it's the most unsolicited advice that is the most annoying!<br /><br />Michelle- that post on the 'lies' was killer btw...loved it.<br /><br />~bruFebruary Gracehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01078037856070486022noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-25574448795004639352011-02-04T12:09:45.577-08:002011-02-04T12:09:45.577-08:00Are we talking about the Endurance or a fictional ...Are we talking about the Endurance or a fictional anthropomorphized ship? (I think a novel about with Endurance as a character would be pretty cool.)Jabezhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09541471929373540252noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-23000517937001810542011-02-04T11:17:51.827-08:002011-02-04T11:17:51.827-08:00Scott- In your defense, you did put "Snark by...Scott- In your defense, you did put "Snark by Scott Bailey" on the cover page under my name, so I knew what to expect. <br /><br />Some of your comments made me cringe, and others made me laugh out loud, even if I didn't agree with them. Most of the feedback was spot-on, though, and it helped me in my revisions.<br /><br />But a critique is not the same as a review. A critique is private; a review is public. When I asked Scott to critique my middle-grade novel, I knew I was going to get a very different perspective from the middle-grade authors (and readers) who also provided feedback. But that diversity of opinion is necessary, and it provided insights that other readers missed.<br /><br />And always remember...just because someone gave you advice, it doesn't mean you have to take it. If you receive bad advice from someone whose advice you openly solicited, don't bitch/complain/whine/moan. You asked for it in the first place.Rick Daleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05173516899130463413noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-44979882537592410622011-02-04T11:05:20.197-08:002011-02-04T11:05:20.197-08:00Susan, that's how I deal with most advice too....Susan, that's how I deal with most advice too.Davin Malasarnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09385823575081492949noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-76922581289261673752011-02-04T10:44:17.710-08:002011-02-04T10:44:17.710-08:00I know exactly what you mean - both on the giving ...I know exactly what you mean - both on the giving of advice I feel less and less qualified to do (which naturally doesn't stop me) and the receiving of advice that goes against what I'm just sure is true. What I try very, very hard to do is not to completely ignore the "bad" advice, but try to listen very hard to what problem the advice-giver is identifying for me. They think they're telling me how to fix it, but what they're really telling me is what is wrong...for them. Then I try to see how I can do that bit better...for everyone. :)Susan Kaye Quinnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07348197999397141067noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-59535127041291238542011-02-04T10:42:39.400-08:002011-02-04T10:42:39.400-08:00Everyone gives or gets bad advice at one time or a...Everyone gives or gets bad advice at one time or another. You just have to let it roll off your back. ;) You got one thing right, though, Go Steelers!!Amanda Bonillahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05983960181205765184noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-78531194834758735842011-02-04T10:33:02.143-08:002011-02-04T10:33:02.143-08:00Alex: Go Phillies! Go Sox!Alex: Go Phillies! Go Sox!scott g.f.baileyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05726743149139510832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-24833332072885132662011-02-04T10:32:22.961-08:002011-02-04T10:32:22.961-08:00"Imagine a world with flying vampire eels.&qu..."Imagine a world with flying vampire eels." I do that every night. Every damned night. It's why I never sleep.scott g.f.baileyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05726743149139510832noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-49684332659423588792011-02-04T10:30:38.578-08:002011-02-04T10:30:38.578-08:00Domey: Simon Cowell was the only reason anyone eve...<b>Domey:</b> Simon Cowell was the only reason anyone ever watched "American Idol". Go for it!<br /><br /><b>Scott:</b> Talk to me again when baseball starts. The Phillies rule. Football sucks, much like the Seachickens.<br /><br /><b>Bad advice:</b> Most of the bad advice I've gotten came from people who didn't read a lot. A family member once told me to give up writing because I had no luck selling a mystery novel - she said, "If you can't sell it, it must not be any good."<br /><br />I decided not to take her advice.<br /><br />I once gave a good friend bad writing advice and now she is kind enough not to let me see her first drafts. I appreciate that no end and it's probably the best way for us to stay good friends.<br /><br />-Alex MacKenzieAlex MacKenziehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14121919349442258779noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2092805684169371138.post-65524435550718156712011-02-04T10:30:35.905-08:002011-02-04T10:30:35.905-08:00@Michelle - I must have gotten my brain sleep last...@Michelle - I must have gotten my brain sleep last night.<br /><br />@Domey - I should have that ready for you any day now.C. N. Nevetshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00375714948653196993noreply@blogger.com